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even more NMB
By: Philip Fried Date: Mar 5, 2010 - 12:47 PM
http://www.newmusicbox.org/chatter/chatter.nmbx?id=6283
digging deeper
By philmusic
Frank a casual look at any elementary band/choir/strings catalog will show 100's of original works. These are performed all over. Not to mention the college and university performance scene where 1000's of composers ply their trade. True in a way this is not public performance.
I was told in Grad School that to be placed in the "new music ghetto" was not such a good thing-strictly B team. Of course this was before the coming of the "popnewmusic" ensembles where sonic exclusivity and prejudice are the selling points. (Personally I prefer to be performed by generalists rather than specialists).
If you are speaking exclusively of the major institutions remember how comparatively hard it is for an American composer to have an international reputation V.S. a European composer. Further though we are constantly looking for the next Bernstein, technically America doesn't have official composers. Nor do we have the government that would fund those kind of high level performances for said composer.
Obviously vision and funding makes the difference. I must agree that the diversity of American new music is not reflected in its Major Institutions. As too whether more high level performance would change that is an open question.
Phil Fried, not running for office
Phil's page
Tuesday, March 02, 2010, 3:20:59 PM
http://www.newmusicbox.org/chatter/chatter.nmbx?id=6286
Sadly, not every one is open minded.
By philmusic
Colin, back in the day I was aware of a number of musicologists and theorists (not to single them out), expert on a particular composer and their music, who privately detested said composer and their music. Does this mean their observations lack insight?
On the other hand a few only liked their subjects music and disliked all others. Did that interfere with them teaching general history or recent music?
Further I was also aware of more than a few musicians who could prove that composition stopped with Mozart. Even if they could, is this true?
Being a professional performer also means occasionally performing music one does not like--does that necessarily make the performance any less persuasive?
Anyway these H.G. Wells comments, which I have never seen before, reflect my own opinion that "like and dislike precede all" the rest is just tautology to make it work.
If art is greater than people that depends on the people and the art.
Phil Fried, who actually thinks that life is just high school all over again.
A Phil Page
http://www.newmusicbox.org/chatter/chatter.nmbx?id=6279
now that you mention it.
By philmusic
Perhaps this would be a good time to bring back smell-o-vision.
Phil Fried
Phil's fragrance free page -- now hypoallergenic!
Thursday, March 04, 2010, 10:23:00 AM
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NMB this week
By: Philip Fried Date: Feb 26, 2010 - 09:52 AM
http://newmusicbox.org/chatter/chatter.nmbx?id=6278
several interesting issues here--audience composers etc.
the directors art
By philmusic
Interesting Frank.
Its been said, and not just by me, that opera has become the directors art. Even here John Adams can't be mentioned without also including Peter Sellers. If only the Met instead of creating all those new productions of "warhorses" commissioned original music to go with them instead.
Of the several Manons for example I am unaware of any that actually follow whats in the book.
Though the Mayor's proclamation is heartening I'm afraid that Europe does the composer better service.
Phil's main Page
On second thought
By philmusic
Chris and Frank, perhaps we are looking at this backwards--
As composers it is our diversity that is our strength.
Phil Fried Phil's extra special page
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NMB and Seqenza21
By: Philip Fried Date: Feb 19, 2010 - 07:35 PM
http://newmusicbox.org/chatter/chatter.nmbx?id=6270
What else is new?
By philmusic
This "opportunity" has some problems. In the first place "one day to work with the ensemble" simply would not be enough time. For me anyway.
Besides, the point is moot because as a serial composer this ensemble would never perform my music.
Phil Fried
Phil'd Page
___
http://www.sequenza21.com/2010/02/20-composers-x-a-50-dollar-application-fee-a-self-funded-commission/comment-page-2/#comments
Phil Fried says:
February 16, 2010 at 9:27 pm
It’s a pity about all those lonely unsolicited scores, Chris. One might suppose there is another pile for the recommended composers. Anyway I’m not included in either pile. A serial composers chances aren’t very good these days.
Even with the best intentions: what you seem to be saying is this:
Your not cool, but if you pay our fee we will show you around the VIP room.
Philip Fried
Phil Fried says:
February 16, 2010 at 11:31 pm
On second thought
Hey there is an opportunity here–why doesn’t 8BB or another a new music ensemble do a marathon reading of every single work submitted?
Say 100 dollar fee but every work is performed with structured limitations of timing and instruments? recording extra???
that sounds a least win win!!!
Phil Fried stressing the positive.
Phil Fried says:
February 16, 2010 at 11:39 pm
naturally one expects more than sight reading.
Phil Fried says:
February 17, 2010 at 8:39 pm
Dennis, I think the entry fee should be $1000 , for each band member.
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NMB fun and not so
By: Philip Fried Date: Feb 13, 2010 - 11:20 AM
http://newmusicbox.org/chatter/chatter.nmbx?id=6267
this is a a sore point for many if as I say here is true: then the new musicology is a "no neck bastard" and simply political speak. Again Pgblu makes an overbearing case obviously he is a goog guy.
Well...
By philmusic
I don't think Colin that you change intentionality by merely changing ones choice of words. Being fired or being downsized or rightsized amounts to the same thing.
Rather one should draw a distinction between what one says and one does.
Phil Fried, Phil's main page
Thursday, February 11, 2010, 8:56:44 AM
US and Them
"McClary' work belongs to what we like to call New Musicology...."
Well I couldn't have put it better myself.
Phil Fried Phil's Page
http://newmusicbox.org/chatter/chatter.nmbx?id=6262
Adorn? No!
By philmusic
No problem Pugblu--it seems that you were correct. Some folks around here have not read the book.
Phil Fried, talking tough as usual. Phil's Page
Cat People Unite!
By philmusic
My cat had a great success in Germany!
Don't get me started on Bunnies!
Phil Fried, will be in NY soon!
Friday, February 05, 2010, 5:38:36 PM
U asked for it!
By philmusic
Bun-Buns Behind Bars
This is one of my facebook albums, perhaps to see them you will have to friend me.
Come on in!
Phil Fried
Thursday, February 11, 2010, 9:00:13 PM
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NMB and seq 21
By: Philip Fried Date: Jan 19, 2010 - 07:37 PM
http://newmusicbox.org/chatter/chatter.nmbx?id=6245
a point... philmusic
1/19/2010 5:53:35 PM
"The point is the media creates interest in what they are interested in."
Beside the polls and focus groups:
The media also creates interest in what they are paid to be interested in. Not to mention what their major advertisers sometimes suggest. Synergy anyone? Payola perhaps?
By the way Frank. As an avid vintage Magazine collector, I knew.
One of Phil's many pages
__________________________
http://newmusicbox.org/chatter/chatter.nmbx?id=6244
I agree with Kyle here, yet I don't see the need to vilify those who don't agree with me. It is just as easy to say uptown=elitist as to say downtown=snobs
anyway..2 cents
By philmusic
In my line of work learning is much simpler if folks can connect what they already know to what they are just about to find out. Program notes can help connect those dots.
Also there are many composers and sound artists who create works that are on the surface incomprehensible (I don't mean good or bad just monochromatic). So with out program notes or the editorial of the curator the audience just won't get it.
For myself, especially with my own vocal works, I want the music to speak for itself.
Finally I think its a big mistake to overlook the sentimental attachments that can only be created by program notes etc. Many careers have been built on just this.
Oddly, I was at a pre-concert talk once where the performer's speech made me hate the composer.
Go figure.
Phil Fried One of Phil's many pages
some humor
Eureka I've got it!
By philmusic
So if I set my program notes to music, then I could set the program notes for my work, program notes set to music, to music.
Then I could set my program notes for the program notes for my other new work program notes to the program notes of my work program notes set to music, to music. Its only a hop, skip, and jump to set the program notes of the program notes of the program notes for my new work program notes to the program notes to the program notes to the program notes of my work program notes set to music, to music.
One question? Is this work programmatic?
Phil Fried, I know I know...
___________________
http://www.sequenza21.com/2010/01/tod-machover-on-music-technology/comment-page-1/#comment-22085
Phil Fried says:
January 19, 2010 at 3:47 pm
a similar post here at my other blog:
http://philipfried.blogspot.com/
Who wants to blog about analog?
Whats with the NY Times and new music?
I suppose this harks back to the old Newsweek and Time magazines coverage from the 1960’s and 1970’s when the “Once Group” and the MN Opera” were used to provide the what is the latest strange thing the arts are up to these days?
Any publicity is good publicity. Right?
On the other hand one was under the impression that the folks who read those reviews and puff pieces were not the folks who attended the performances. With over 10,000 composers in the NYC area perhaps that’s no longer true.
In every case the subject of these NYT profiles are folks who present their ideas through music. They are also really really cool.
Simply put; the NYT presents composers for whom the music does not come first. Text, or in this case technology, based work is easier to explain in text of course.
During hard times its nice to know that stage machinery and set dressing can now be run by software alone.
American ingenuity-I take off my hat.
Phil Fried
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NMB this week
By: Philip Fried Date: Dec 18, 2009 - 11:46 AM
http://newmusicbox.org/chatter/chatter.nmbx?id=6220
oh well..
By philmusic
Music encompasses multiple ways to notate anything musical. Even the note "C". I suppose one has to draw a line between being "too fussy" and being accurate. This comes with experience.
Than again in many of popular music's melodic lines and raps there is a rhythmic complexity that is problamatic to notate. It's hard to read, yet not to hard to learn by rote.
Go figure.
Phil Fried, Skid Row University, Free Beer!!
Comments: 0 Edit
this NMB thread keeps going and going...
By: Philip Fried Date: Dec 10, 2009 - 06:07 PM
composers powerful?
By philmusic
Um Ryan, if I take your comment seriously, perhaps not the best idea, I need to point out that you seem to be confusing a "person" or an "activity" with a position of power.
For example Louis B. Mayer was thought to be a very powerful man. Yet that power was not his. It only resided in his job at MGM. When he left that job he was nobody.
Period.
There are many other cases like this at many other; institutions, colleges and universities, also politics etc. Composers are included of course.
Yet its not because one is a composer that they have power. Rather its because one is invested with a position of power by others.
Phil Fried PhilFried.com
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NMB replies
By: Philip Fried Date: Dec 2, 2009 - 07:33 PM
Check my other blog http://philipfried.blogspot.com/
http://newmusicbox.org/chatter/chatter.nmbx?id=6190
A different View.
By philmusic
Doctors are by their profession hierarchical. So I am tempted to say that these comments have nothing to do with musical styles at all, you might have been all tonal all the time.
Rather these comments are dismissive and designed to keep you at arms length because of his/her preferred relationship with you. Doctor patient.
What I am also saying is that a composer, any composer, might be a person of reverence to them, and that won't happen by mere conversation. A famous surgeon on the other hand just might.
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things heat up at NMB
By: Philip Fried Date: Nov 7, 2009 - 08:43 AM
http://newmusicbox.org/chatter/chatter.nmbx?id=6170
I chimed in late on this on Pugblu was getting highfalutin, I'm a little surprise by the inflexibility of mind here. The answer to the question of whether "music is a language" according to him and Colin is not to be trusted to musicians but only to the linguists. Linguists may have no interest in music whatsoever. They may also be failed composers and performers with an axe to grind.
More important the privileged nature of text based language, their very profession, is at stake in this discussion. Academic self interest is the 300 pound gorilla in the room that nobody admits to seeing.
So this is a zero sum game. A competition. That is my point--a zero sum game has winners and losers. This trickles down into music education is being discarded in favor of text based language testing.
lets not get excited now...
By philmusic
“Music doesn't do anything, it's morally inert until it is used for something -- good or evil alike…”
Walt Whitman said as much for his poems and the same can be said for any language. I believe that H.G. Wells pointed out that to control minds you had to control language.
My point is that music is a language and a form of communication. Isn’t there a purpose to learning how to communicate? Doesn’t learning a language have a particular benefit?
Rather it’s the fact that one can use any language to lie, cheat, and steal, and worse, that doesn’t mean anything. Other than criminal culpability.
I find it particularly irresponsible when the private world of scholars and college professors say things about the most esoteric phenomena, and in their own private language, which then puts music education at risk.
That’s my job your mess’in with.
Phil Fried, PhilFried.com Happy at Last.
its getting hot..
By philmusic
Um, I'm not an ethnomusicologist but there are several cultures, not just primitive, that use instrumental music for communication, and in a very specific way. The Hmong for example.
One might also include morse code as a rhythmic pattern but thats besides the point. One thing language does is that it can attempt to persuade. Thats out of my line.
What you are really asking for is a direct translation of sound, say a Mozart String Quartet, into words. It seems that you are giving priority to text based language here. Of course there are many who feel that text based language has no meaning either. The fact that babelfish can't translate music to text proves nothing.
Believe what you need to believe.
Phil Fried, who feels good about many things
Coffee tea and tautology
By philmusic
The important issue here is what insight is gained by holding the opinion that music is not a language.
Obviously “distancing” can give you a vantage point of dismissive power. Part and parcel of that dismissiveness is that all you seem to offer is what music can’t do. Perhaps this opinion is simply the price of admission to the team and to hold any other opinion would be deemed unprofessional or worse.
That’s not insight.
Phil Fried, perhaps not as happy as he would like.
Thursday, November 05, 2009, 10:01:42 AM
Now I get it...or do I?
By philmusic
"...I don't think anyone loses out if we make it clear that music is not a language - "
You haven't made it clear. All you've made clear is your refusal to see that this point could be disputed.
Nice advantage that.
Phil Fried, who needs to practice more
my last word on this I swear...
By philmusic
The answer to the question of whether "music is a language" is evidently not to be trusted to musicians but only to linguists. Linguists that may have no interest in music whatsoever. Or they may be failed composers and performers with an axe to grind.
More importantly the privileged nature of text based language, the linguists very profession, is at stake in such a discussion. Academic self interest, not the search for truth, is the 800 pound gorilla in the room.
So this is a zero sum game, a death match competition. That is my point--a zero sum game has winners and losers. This trickles down into music education that is now being discarded in favor of text based language testing.
I have to disagree that I am attempting to persuade here. Rather I see myself as an immovable object.
Phil Fried, who talks big
well maybe not..
By philmusic
Phil, music education cannot possibly be synonymous with learning "how to listen to music" -- if it's really that, then it's nothing more than indoctrination, and for all I care, music ed can vanish off the face of the earth.
You seem to be confusing how and why. Is this another linguistic technique for quashing dissent? The rest just seems tit for tat.
Um, I thought we were all music educators here.
I'm afraid your comments are all too typical of the disconnect between the appointed thinkers of our profession and the doers.
Phil Fried, PhilFried.com
[this is the breaking point it seems no one likes being the "other" but the disconnect is real]
rapprochement? Perhaps?
By philmusic
Students know why they listen to music, and educators give them the tools to explore further. They do not act as indoctrinators or as cheerleaders or as PR-people..
Pgblu, I must disagree here, I personally know many teachers who sell soap, sad to say. I'm not sure that everyone knows why they listen either. Many kids don't know about payola, and don't know that commercial radio time can be bought and is. Hardly any realize that if they chose to listen to "death metal music" the kids who listen to "alternative" won't speak to them. They certainly don't know why, at the local arts high school, young classical musicians must hide themselves because everyone else will think them nerds. Anyway I don't know any teachers who teach just "passive" listening. I'm an instrumental teacher myself and class room music teachers are vocal specialists or are supposed to be.
So we must agree to disagree. My vision of music just seems more nuanced than yours, reflecting my experience, that doesn't make it better.
Anyway, my apologies to you. You seem to have interpreted my general comments for personal ones. Yet I would rather feel you anger a thousand fold than pretend its not there. [pretend that these issues aren't important]
Phil Fried
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NMB replies an I get a cudo
By: Philip Fried Date: Oct 22, 2009 - 06:43 PM
http://newmusicbox.org/chatter/chatter.nmbx?id=6159
Did I leave someone out?
By philmusic
"we'd finally recover from the masterpiece syndrome... "
Frank I'm not sure about this idea--in this way. For example, Beethoven wasn't trying to corner the market, just doing the best he could--we all are.
Rather it's the; associates, the hangers on, the followers, the invested, the self interested, the power hungry, the gate keepers, the axe grinders, the know nothings, the smug, the self proclaimed, the Ad men, the Ad women, the profiteers, the teachers, the college professors, and the publicists, who draw a line in the sand and say art stops here.
Phil Fried, already included, but thanks for asking.
One of Phil's many pages
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nmb--Phil talks tough again...
By: Philip Fried Date: Oct 10, 2009 - 05:28 PM
http://newmusicbox.org/chatter/chatter.nmbx?id=6147
I'll Say..
By philmusic
"The Biggest Disaster in the History of Art"
...Is the tendency of small minded people to aggressively assert their stupidity. Sad to say that includes musicians and gate keepers too.
Phil Fried, PhilFried.com no sonic prejudice
more than a flash of anger
By philmusic
Ah, I remember the days when in interviews pop bands related (probably on their publicist's orders) that if Mozart was alive to day he would be a member of "Hermans Hermits" etc etc... It seems now that a lot of folks believe it.
Music with intellectual content has been discarded in favor of the catchy tune as the social necessity of all music has changed, for example, the popularity of dance music over listening music, and the ubiquity of radio and popular music. Classical Radio follows suit in their programing of easy listening.
Its the cheapest form of hindsight to speculate on what Mozart's career would be today. I think a number of folks have commented on the failure of his career in his lifetime. I would assume that his experience today would be no different because oddly enough he was the cutting edge in his time.
Phil Fried, not so angry, PhilFried.com
PS to say that popular music ic based on Mozart leaves a whole lot of African Americans out of the loop.
Comments: 0 Edit
bloging on NMB again
By: Philip Fried Date: Oct 2, 2009 - 09:38 PM
http://newmusicbox.org/chatter/chatter.nmbx?id=6146
truly said, and not just in church..
By philmusic
"..where mediocrity is actually something people are trying to achieve—and it is not being led necessarily by musicians, but by the politics..."
Music composition is an area where mediocrity is not only tolerated; its demanded.
Phil Fried, PhilFried.com
http://newmusicbox.org/chatter/chatter.nmbx?id=6139
now that you mention it...
By philmusic
It is unfortunate that so much of our musical world is defined by marketers with products to sell. Statistics and polls are so easy to “color” for political purposes. A “box” is presented to us and we are forced to work within it no matter how uncongenial.
Sometimes one has to refuse.
Phil Fried, PhilFried.com
________________
http://newmusicbox.org/chatter/chatter.nmbx?id=6140
no sonic prejudice
By philmusic
Well if you believe that music can make you smarter, it’s just a hop, skip, and jump to believe that music can make you all sorts of things.
For others it’s not the music at all but the total package. In this case music becomes a fashion accessory for a look or an attitude. As the old “outlaw” attitude gets domesticated a new one comes along. This creates anxiety. Meanness has always been the other side of being “hip.” Anyway these looks and ideas are mostly created by corporate marketers to sell product. For most it’s a pose.
In any case every profession has its nuts and weirdoes.
Phil Fried, no sonic prejudice
an odd paradigm
By philmusic
Well you see folks have no problem with erotic music, as long there is no profanity, but folks have a big problem with erotic images.
On the other hand folks have no problem with violent images, yet seem have a big problem with violent music, profanity or not.
Combine them? Look out!
The thing is we are not really taking about music at all but about text. That is the words to songs, stories, scenarios etc.
Violence in words is another kettle of fish altogether.
Phil Fried, Phil Fried.com
Well sometimes...
By philmusic--Ralph is talking about something else here " Music has everything to do with the interpretation of text." but sometimes its the other way around. He doesn't get I'm talking about a particular kind of music...
Ralph, you have a point especially with the examples you give. That said the relationship of text to music is, where there is a relationship, quite variable.
In the context of some popular (and other) music the exact same accompaniment can be used to set many many different texts. In that case, and there are quite a few, the only difference is the text, and perhaps the scansion to make it fit.
In those cases the music being generic is not crucial, the text being different is.
Perhaps you overlooked the fact that the music videos and their scenarios are text objects. In that case music can underscore a purely visual image (of course someone was needed to write the scene even if there is no dialog).
Anyway, the text/title/music relationship is a subject of infinite discussion which I doubt we will all agree.
Phil Fried PhilFried.com
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NMB well comments ya know
By: Philip Fried Date: Sep 24, 2009 - 04:16 PM
http://newmusicbox.org/chatter/chatter.nmbx?id=6134
I'm starting to feel that though they like my posts--they must think I'm a road hog
--it seems that it takes days before my posts are posted?
It is typical of language to reinvent itself every generation more so for
academic language. It has been my observation that behind the jargon and
hair splitting is the very simple concepts of like and dislike. There is
something else too.
Consider Hugo Leichtentritt defense of Schoenberg's music: Its good
therefore tonal.
In response to Schenker, and his students, who said this about Schoenberg:
Its bad therefore not tonal. Both schools of thought share the same
underlying tenant (paradigm) that tonality is the basis of a successful
composition. So, it doesn't occur to either of them that they might both
be right as in; Its good therefore not tonal.
Many still maintain that "consonant" music is tonal and good and that
"dissonance" music is non tonal and bad.
The paradigm shift that non-tonal music is an marvelous entity all its own
and isn't really tonal is still not universally accepted.
Untill these details are hashed out expect imprecision.
Phil Fried, Phil Fried.com
Comments: 0 Edit
censored? by NMB?
By: Philip Fried Date: Sep 19, 2009 - 11:49 PM
http://newmusicbox.org/chatter/chatter.nmbx?id=6127
I can't contact these folks any more--what is it? my e-mails are returned???
anyway Dan is starting to get on my nerves--thought its true I can be a hot head!!
"..I can't recommend youth and school orchestras enough as potential
collaborators for less-established composers hungry for experience."
I like your posts. Really I do. Its just that here I think your tone
seems directed at a classroom of the select few rather than the many
thousands who might read these posts. The fact you have been commissioned 4
times in this area is a marvelous thing but I wonder how many of us can
duplicate it.
Yes I know that visualization can be the key to success, but
there are many different kinds of success aren't there?
Of course you have to tell the truth. Its just a matter of tone.
Actually if I have a bone to pick about this it has mostly been with the
posts of the performers, whom seem blithely unaware that, most likely, they will
never perform our music.
The assumption that we are all fans and not supplicants.
Stymied at that.
Phil Fried, philfried.com,who swears hes not bitter
Comments: 0 Edit
NMB replies
By: Philip Fried Date: Sep 2, 2009 - 05:09 PM
http://newmusicbox.org/chatter/chatter.nmbx?id=6106
The difference between "people" and "objects" seems pretty obvious doesn't it? Yet when you have an axe to grind such niceties hardly matter....mclaren is one of those people, also I get boored with the one monolithic answer to everything ie the dissertation approach...
Good for the goose
By philmusic
"..Contemporary composers ...can write rhythms for small ensembles which are impossible for large orchestras to play, due to "the lack of rehearsal time available" for the large orchestras and their "lack of familiarity" with the musical style involved.... "Classically trained symphony performers are completely unable to play such rhythms."
My experience with orchestral players might be different then yours but Mclaren, which is it? Are you saying that orchestral players can't do it or they could do it if they had the time, or that they have no interest in learning to perform it? Even if what you are implying is so, and its not, this wouldn't be a problem of the performers but rather a problem of performing institutions and entrepreneurship.
Three things on orchestration, which I kind of like doing.
1)on Broadway professional orchestrators are needed for the many issues that swamp a composer leaving them with no time to do anything but make changes in the master score; rehearsals, new songs intros etc.
Note: Just a short time working with Opera Bob, for only a 50 minuet program, showed me this was true. Even on the small scale the amount of time needed to cover all the artistic bases is just not there.
2) Many pop recordings do adhere to strict sonic profiles-which of course that can be the producers and engineers job. Some of these sonic profiles rightly have become famous and are widely imitated.
3) as too blame it on the Beatles, Jazz performers and the"signature song and sound" also operate as un-imatatable authentic sources and long before the Beatles too.
Phil Fried PhilFried.com, OperaBob.org
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NMB replies
By: Philip Fried Date: Jul 29, 2009 - 10:56 AM
http://newmusicbox.org/chatter/chatter.nmbx?id=6077
Mr A C D just doesn't get it.
right to the point
By philmusic
Understanding musical nomenclature is not the same as understanding musical art.
Phil Fried, Philfried.com. Operabob.org
Maybe...
By philmusic
You don't have to have perfect pitch to be able to identify a chord progression by sound alone.
You can play by ear and not have perfect pitch either.
In some cases its in fact easier to play by ear than to read the charts.
Phil Fried philfried.com,operabob.org
not really
By philmusic
"...But you do need perfect pitch to be able to notate the actual heard notes that make up that heard progression..."
I must disagree here.
In fact with a handy piano to refer to, and a handy playback on the recording, not to mention a means to notate, it is possible to find all the notes the keys etc.
I believe its called pitch matching and it only takes time.
Phil Fried Philfried.com, operaBob.org
Comments: 0 Edit
Phil blogging about RW's new opera in 3 sentances
By: Philip Fried Date: Jul 14, 2009 - 05:44 PM
http://artsandentertainment.independentminds.livejournal.com/574497.html?view=1457697#t1457697
Oh my. Why does it take “bravery” to commission “classical music” from yet another unskilled glamorous pop star? Beside the fact that Mr. Wainwright is completely unknown to the “person in the street” the bigger question is; why do opera companies avoid commissioning trained composers?
Re: Jealousy, thy name is PhilMusic1000
[info]philmusic1000 wrote:
Wednesday, 15 July 2009 at 04:39 pm (UTC)
You misunderstand. I have no disregard for Mr. Wainwright only for the process by which he was commissioned. As for "back up" Manchester is welcome to commission me any time. Perhaps they would commission David Walliams, that's more likely, and I could appear as his stunt double?
Phil Fried, PhilFried.com OperaBob.org
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yet another 2 nmb replies
By: Philip Fried Date: Jul 1, 2009 - 05:50 PM
http://newmusicbox.org/chatter/chatter.nmbx?id=6047
I always find the wrong questions asked here. Anyway to make my point more plain if you don't take the gig they don't ever call you again It seems that folks hem and haw when it comes to K.G. Go figure.
on professionalism
By philmusic
Applying for grants awards etc, are part of a composers professional activities. There is an expectation that composers or any musician wanting to be professional will take part. This is tradition. So, it could be said that many musical folks, including composition teachers, expect their students to apply and some to win - greater the reflective glory for them, their school, and their institution.
What happens if you turn down an opportunity? What happens if you refuse awards? What happens to folks or students who are "unprofessional?" For whatever reason? It may be good. May be not.
The world goes on doesn't it?
Oh, there is one thing that bugs me about competitions--the style police and misleading advertising.
Many times I have applied for "music composition" grants that were judged by "sound artists." Since, oddly enough, I can apply in both categories but can only chose one this can be perplexing to say the least.
Phil Fried, PhilFried.com OperaBob.org
--------------------------------------
the enemy is us
By philmusic
Entry fees are not a global red flag. Where is this myth coming from?
Well June the American Composer Forum tells its members not to apply for such opportunities and I agree.
Kyle, I know a number of composers grants that are judged by panels that include folks other than composers, performers for example. Many times panels include administrators and gatekeepers. The NEA grants for example included professional types who were not even musicians.
Some panels may be made up of composers, but I would use that term loosely as I, nor anyone else, has ever heard of them. Nor will. Sorry June. Of course that doesn't mean anything.
[Of course there is a difference between being known and being qualified isn't there?]
Kyle the panel you described would be a nightmare for me. I would have had to resign.
Phil Fried, who talks big. Philfried.com operabob.org
Comments: 0 Edit
this week's NMB -short and sweet
By: Philip Fried Date: Jun 12, 2009 - 11:19 AM
http://newmusicbox.org/chatter/chatter.nmbx?id=6025
Location, Location, Location
By philmusic
"..American Idol may be the most significant locus of study in the field of performance practice..."
Well, there goes the neighborhood.
Phil Fried, PhilFried.com
___________________________________________________
http://newmusicbox.org/chatter/chatter.nmbx?id=6032
I go too far here but I must say that counterpoint is not a feature of a lot of recent American music--at least counterpoint that has real independence -for that reason the piano/solo instrument thought from Ms. Higdon has no resonace fo me.
empty toolchest?
By philmusic
"American music is vertical; European music is more linear/horizontal."
Generalizations tend to be wrong, but if this "is" so then its a training issue.
A linear approach to my mind means a mastery of counterpoint. Mastery of this technique is created by extensive study and use not by taking just a semester or two in college. The experience of the teacher also counts. How may American music composition programs require counterpoint as a core subject? I would think that the ones that do would show the results.
On the other hand, counterpoint as a musical technique is an intellectual approach to musical problems and as such is out of favor these days at least in the USA.
Am I suggesting that an inadequately trained composer could be successful even have their works demanded over better trained ones? Actually no. Talent will trump training. We do tend to forget just how well trained folks like John Cage and Eric Satie were.
Rather I find that many American composers over-compose and add too much spoiling the beauty.
Phil Fried, PhilFried.com, Operabob.org
a shot in the dark
By philmusic
"..But you know Phil, the first thing that came to mind for me when I read that is free improvisation (very broad term there) which often relies heavily upon and generates some stunning results from a "vertical" approach to playing very much in the moment..."
My experience with free improvisation has lead me to believe that it is more linear than vertical, but point taken. It is easy to misunderstand when we all have a slightly or completely different view of what our terms mean.
Anyway I was referring specifically style-wise to music like British composer Bob Chilcott who's music sounds completely vertical to me.
Phil Fried,PhilFried.com, operabob.org
a small rewrite
By philmusic
"..On the other hand, counterpoint as a musical technique is an intellectual approach to musical problems and as such is out of favor these days."
When I first responded here I admit that I did not know who Mr. Chilcott was or what he composed and so I took his comments at face value. Now that I know I find his remarks bizarre.
To use my own case in a "popular style"
A Children's garden of Peace
Oh I am a string instrument player by the way.
Phil Fried, PhilFRied.com, operabob.org
final point
By philmusic
Its not easy to remember that though some of us live in music it is a world much larger than ourselves.
Phil Fried, hoping to avoid an international indecent.
______________________________________________
Candor by Philmusic
http://newmusicbox.org/chatter/chatter.nmbx?id=6034
Let's all stop blaming academia for our personal problems.
I would like to comment here I really would, but I'm afraid I have nothing nice to say. Pthoege, I feel your pain but Academic insiders are Academic insiders no matter what style of music they offer. Period.
Whatever my academic career was or was suppose to be I say this: There is not a single person I went to school with that I would have as a colleague.
So I don't.
Phil Fried, PhilFried.com Operabob.org
Comments: 0 Edit
nmb review Eric Saltzman
By: Philip Fried Date: May 30, 2009 - 08:33 AM
http://newmusicbox.org/article.nmbx?id=6006
This seems misnamed for me because the conversation here is not about audiences at all but about performance rituals. These rituals include the listeners as well as the performers, staging, etc. into its totality. Mr. Saltzman is an experienced musician/creator an I wonder whether he is staking out a position rather than providing insight.
For example though an audience will take part in, lets say, the performance rituals of grand opera, it is quite common for those same folks to take part in many other rituals connected to many other different kinds of entertainments. The "audience" is not a discrete entity. Also performance rituals for grand opera can vary from place to place, country to country, and even to a particular performance space.
Performance art may have rituals distinct from grand opera but rituals they are. Further the audience does not create these rituals rather the gate keepers do so by their expectations. One of the badges of membership into certain "crowds" (hipness for example) is the ability to know these differing expectations and to act accordingly.
One doesn't want to be a tourist.
The whole issue of "what an audience is" is not answered at all. This question can be explosive as it would reveal a secret--that audiences are made up of interested and disinterested folks. This would also include professional and captive contingents. This includes those who attend from obligation and the quid pro quo. The captive audience is something not much mentioned and this is not just referring to papering the house either. Students are many times required to attended performances, as are grad students, colleges, frenemies you name it. more later
Phil
Comments: 0 Edit
nmb roundup
By: Philip Fried Date: May 29, 2009 - 11:00 AM
http://newmusicbox.org/chatter/chatter.nmbx?id=6012
thought or action?
By philmusic
"..Thinking and worrying...worrying and thinking,..It's a vicious circle.." Victor/Victoria
Just grab the Tiger by the tail. It will be one wild ride.
Phil Fried, http://Philfried.com Worry free since...well who am I kidding?
Wednesday, May 27, 2009, 2:06:11 PM
________________________________
http://newmusicbox.org/chatter/chatter.nmbx?id=6010
there is a sub text here-- one that has to do with power-you know how that bugs me.
presto chango
By philmusic
I've composed that way as well. Mostly I have composed directly into score-no changes. Perhaps this has something to do with the fact that I compose opera and vocal music - and also solo improvisation.
I know what your thinking --those changes at least in theatrical music will be forth coming!
Anyway, I have also composed by multi preliminary sketches that end up bearing no resemblance to the final composition at all.
Personal misdirection. -go figure!
Phil Fried, Skid Roe University, Free Beer!
Friday, May 22, 2009, 2:59:17 PM
Comments: 0 Edit
NMB less is more
By: Philip Fried Date: May 22, 2009 - 01:41 PM
http://newmusicbox.org/chatter/chatter.nmbx?id=5992
Well not too much--here again the the big fish eat the little fish--speaking of the nonbobs of negativity!
On the other hand...
By philmusic
"Nobody is in the repertoire."
Well. Then nobody's out of it either.
Even us nobodies.
Phil Fried, PhilFried.com.
Comments: 0 Edit
school stuff
By: Philip Fried Date: May 2, 2009 - 02:48 PM
OK folks if you don't know by now my employer SPPS has decided to cut 10 band positions in the elementary area. So I have this site: http://keepinstrumentalmusicinsaintpaul.blogspot.com/
I have also been dealing with various problems about being an activist. Needless to say that cutting jobs can bring out the best and the worst in people.
Everyone has worked hard to get the word out --this hard work got our cuts reduced by about half. This means a single teacher will work 5 programs in 5 schools in 5 days 1 school per day. We offered to consult on any restructuring of the instrumental programs and the district agreed.
We are now at phase 2 -- what to do next?
1. Do we work with the district, or not? We offered too.
2. How do we continue to press job reinstatements?
The biggest difficulty is this that those with the least to lose, that is the oldest veterans with complete job security, do nothing, or stir the pot of fear, grandstand, and bad mouth, Yet when the time comes for tough decisions --disappear. Venting anger does not move a process forward.
Comments: 0 Edit
thi9s week NMB
By: Philip Fried Date: Apr 16, 2009 - 09:43 PM
http://newmusicbox.org/chatter/chatter.nmbx?id=5945
Me being bad
a old story
By philmusic
Oh, is there not one maiden breast
Which does not feel the moral beauty
Of making worldly interest
Subordinate to sense of duty?
W.S. Gilbert
Sometimes the way of the gossip is paved with good intentions?
What of Loyalty?
Reciprocity?
What of the good ole Quid pro quo?
Being a member of a particular team may also mean towing the party line, at least in public. Perhaps in America, being a larger country, this is less intense. Well perhaps. Anyway there is a price to pay when you join a team, and an even higher one if you don't.
Phil Fried Phil's composition page
the best of all possible worlds
By philmusic
"...Personally, I think we American composers have to remain as independent and apolitical as possible. Our forefathers are Ives and Nancarrow (et al)..."
Matt, Mr. Nacarrow fought in the Spanish Civil War as a member of the Abraham Lincoln Brigade, and lived in Mexico because of his dedication to communism.
I'm afraid some political and life choices have to be made and these do have consequences even for Americans.
Phil Fried
Thursday, April 09, 2009, 11:03:41 PM
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nmb review Eric Saltzman
By: Philip Fried Date: May 30, 2009 - 08:33 AM
http://newmusicbox.org/article.nmbx?id=6006
This seems misnamed for me because the conversation here is not about audiences at all but about performance rituals. These rituals include the listeners as well as the performers, staging, etc. into its totality. Mr. Saltzman is an experienced musician/creator an I wonder whether he is staking out a position rather than providing insight.
For example though an audience will take part in, lets say, the performance rituals of grand opera, it is quite common for those same folks to take part in many other rituals connected to many other different kinds of entertainments. The "audience" is not a discrete entity. Also performance rituals for grand opera can vary from place to place, country to country, and even to a particular performance space.
Performance art may have rituals distinct from grand opera but rituals they are. Further the audience does not create these rituals rather the gate keepers do so by their expectations. One of the badges of membership into certain "crowds" (hipness for example) is the ability to know these differing expectations and to act accordingly.
One doesn't want to be a tourist.
The whole issue of "what an audience is" is not answered at all. This question can be explosive as it would reveal a secret--that audiences are made up of interested and disinterested folks. This would also include professional and captive contingents. This includes those who attend from obligation and the quid pro quo. The captive audience is something not much mentioned and this is not just referring to papering the house either. Students are many times required to attended performances, as are grad students, colleges, frenemies you name it. more later
Phil
Comments: -1 Edit
nmb roundup
By: Philip Fried Date: May 29, 2009 - 11:00 AM
http://newmusicbox.org/chatter/chatter.nmbx?id=6012
thought or action?
By philmusic
"..Thinking and worrying...worrying and thinking,..It's a vicious circle.." Victor/Victoria
Just grab the Tiger by the tail. It will be one wild ride.
Phil Fried, http://Philfried.com Worry free since...well who am I kidding?
Wednesday, May 27, 2009, 2:06:11 PM
________________________________
http://newmusicbox.org/chatter/chatter.nmbx?id=6010
there is a sub text here-- one that has to do with power-you know how that bugs me.
presto chango
By philmusic
I've composed that way as well. Mostly I have composed directly into score-no changes. Perhaps this has something to do with the fact that I compose opera and vocal music - and also solo improvisation.
I know what your thinking --those changes at least in theatrical music will be forth coming!
Anyway, I have also composed by multi preliminary sketches that end up bearing no resemblance to the final composition at all.
Personal misdirection. -go figure!
Phil Fried, Skid Roe University, Free Beer!
Friday, May 22, 2009, 2:59:17 PM
Comments: 0 Edit
NMB less is more
By: Philip Fried Date: May 22, 2009 - 01:41 PM
http://newmusicbox.org/chatter/chatter.nmbx?id=5992
Well not too much--here again the the big fish eat the little fish--speaking of the nonbobs of negativity!
On the other hand...
By philmusic
"Nobody is in the repertoire."
Well. Then nobody's out of it either.
Even us nobodies.
Phil Fried, PhilFried.com.
Comments: 0 Edit
school stuff
By: Philip Fried Date: May 2, 2009 - 02:48 PM
OK folks if you don't know by now my employer SPPS has decided to cut 10 band positions in the elementary area. So I have this site: http://keepinstrumentalmusicinsaintpaul.blogspot.com/
I have also been dealing with various problems about being an activist. Needless to say that cutting jobs can bring out the best and the worst in people.
Everyone has worked hard to get the word out --this hard work got our cuts reduced by about half. This means a single teacher will work 5 programs in 5 schools in 5 days 1 school per day. We offered to consult on any restructuring of the instrumental programs and the district agreed.
We are now at phase 2 -- what to do next?
1. Do we work with the district, or not? We offered too.
2. How do we continue to press job reinstatements?
The biggest difficulty is this that those with the least to lose, that is the oldest veterans with complete job security, do nothing, or stir the pot of fear, grandstand, and bad mouth, Yet when the time comes for tough decisions --disappear. Venting anger does not move a process forward.
Comments: 0 Edit
thi9s week NMB
By: Philip Fried Date: Apr 16, 2009 - 09:43 PM
http://newmusicbox.org/chatter/chatter.nmbx?id=5945
Me being bad
a old story
By philmusic
Oh, is there not one maiden breast
Which does not feel the moral beauty
Of making worldly interest
Subordinate to sense of duty?
W.S. Gilbert
Sometimes the way of the gossip is paved with good intentions?
What of Loyalty?
Reciprocity?
What of the good ole Quid pro quo?
Being a member of a particular team may also mean towing the party line, at least in public. Perhaps in America, being a larger country, this is less intense. Well perhaps. Anyway there is a price to pay when you join a team, and an even higher one if you don't.
Phil Fried Phil's composition page
the best of all possible worlds
By philmusic
"...Personally, I think we American composers have to remain as independent and apolitical as possible. Our forefathers are Ives and Nancarrow (et al)..."
Matt, Mr. Nacarrow fought in the Spanish Civil War as a member of the Abraham Lincoln Brigade, and lived in Mexico because of his dedication to communism.
I'm afraid some political and life choices have to be made and these do have consequences even for Americans.
Phil Fried
Thursday, April 09, 2009, 11:03:41 PM
Comments: 0 Edit
keep elementary instrumental music in the saint paul public schools
By: Philip Fried Date: Apr 3, 2009 - 11:03 AM
If my posts seem thin its because most of my time is now spent on this:
http://keepinstrumentalmusicinsaintpaul.blogspot.com
http://keepimtinsaintpaul.blogspot.com
These links do work just click the title when you get there!
Wish me luck folks--as I am one of the teachers who might get cut.
Comments: 0 Edit
nmb-not too much check my other blog
By: Philip Fried Date: Mar 27, 2009 - 06:37 PM
http://newmusicbox.org/chatter/chatter.nmbx?id=5912
I'm starting to notice synergy in the topics and posts hmmmm? stay tuned
reverse engineering
By philmusic
Frank I read this post twice to see if I could add anything of interest. Perhaps its this:
A solo work might have all the gestural elements that any work might have. Bach used polyphonic melody to great effect and thats a difficult technique to master in any (or at any) age. We can now use visual/theatrical techniques in solo works the possibilities are daunting if you think about it.
As an improviser/composer I create solo works by the bag full.
It's just that I don't think about it.
Phil Fried
check my philfried.blogspot.com blog for more pressing matters
http://newmusicbox.org/chatter/chatter.nmbx?id=5926
now that you mention it.
By philmusic
The biggest thing I felt I had to keep in mind was that the players have to be won over in order for the audience to be won over.
Good point Colin--the players are the audience.
Phil Fried, Philfried.com
Comments: 0 Edit
not much here from NMB check my web page for Vida!!!
By: Philip Fried Date: Mar 13, 2009 - 06:26 PM
http://newmusicbox.org/chatter/chatter.nmbx?id=5891
I shouldn't have done it you know its just that MP is sooooo smug about his lack of experiance, as if its a good thing. Lets just hope he never has health issues, personal issues, financial issues, or work issues, that might interfear with composing every day. Oh and did he mention his teacher again?
as for cherry picking please-- I could have picked Duparc, Varese, Webern, and many others.
Behind door number one...
By philmusic
"...Therefore, young composers should be encouraged to learn how to write as much as possible..."
Well you've got Sri Chimnoy, on one hand and Mahler, who mostly composed in the summers, on the other.
Tough choice huh?
Phil Fried, check his blog on blogspot for a related topic.
you can cherry pick your friends
By philmusic
Its interesting that you did not chose Telemann, or Gretry as your example.
The point is quantity does not guarantee quality.
Phil Fried
Check out my Vids! on youtube and at
http://philfried.com
Comments: 0 Edit
even less NMB this week-check my other blog
By: Philip Fried Date: Mar 7, 2009 - 06:26 PM
I suppose I thought myself above the fray this week what with the SPPS wanting to elimiate 19.5 band positions, mine included, I did not care to speak of a self serving wish list--number one keep my job teaching music to children etc etc etc.
http://newmusicbox.org/chatter/chatter.nmbx?id=5884
not everywhere
By philmusic
Its interesting that in Opera mostly you can applaud after every aria, duet etc. There are some exceptions of course, later Wagner for example, and certain theaters.
Phil Fried
Comments: 0 Edit
nota loita NMB this week
By: Philip Fried Date: Feb 20, 2009 - 02:03 PM
http://newmusicbox.org/chatter/chatter.nmbx?id=5871
the alleged lisa is being bad again...
now that you mention it...
By philmusic
".. the fact that our government wastes tons of money on foolish and evil projects is not a strong argument to throw crumbs around to anyone who asks. .."
Or throw stones either.
Phil Fried
____________________________________
http://newmusicbox.org/chatter/chatter.nmbx?id=5873
Ok
By philmusic
"..Last time I checked, being "weird" is a pretty important thing when it comes to art. .."
Style is a great thing. Content is better.
Phil Fried, no sonic prejudice.
Comments: 0 Edit
more NMB
By: Philip Fried Date: Feb 13, 2009 - 04:31 PM
http://newmusicbox.org/chatter/chatter.nmbx?id=5868
"...and it's true that sitting one out on the bench doesn't tank your
carreer...writing some lame, half-assed sketch of a piece does..."
I'm not so sure about that. Among the many composers I know - getting the "job" and
keeping it comes before all other considerations.
This is the professional mindset and not to be confused with artistic judgements.
This does not imply that successful composers are making artistic compromises for that commercial
success. We have had these discussions before its just that some composers
have a knack for the pulse of now. More power to them. <br><br>
Yet, if one allows for the many opinions composers have for each others
work, not just their own, the very opposite is true. To paraphrase a well
know composer -
Not only is 3rd rate composition tolerated-its demanded.
Comments: 0 Edit
Back from NY more NMB roundups.
By: Philip Fried Date: Feb 6, 2009 - 07:23 PM
It seems that its the same converstaions again and again folks pretending to have opinions being "bad" saying dumb and dunber thnngs so I get w-ell you'll see:
http://newmusicbox.org/chatter/chatter.nmbx?id=5849
????
By philmusic
"...A charge that was raised herein, and one which frequently gets raised by folks who are anti-modernist, is that modernism engages in a willful obfuscation with the audience..."
Green
Rock
brake
noodle
small
kleghorn
shark
cola
Ebola
credit swap
Am I getting warm?
Phil Fried
Monday, February 02, 2009, 7:50:59 PM
Comments: 0 Edit
NYC performances!! not much NMB
By: Philip Fried Date: Jan 16, 2009 - 05:29 PM
Phil's NY performances
Host:
Music on MacDougal
Type:
Music/Arts - Concert
Network:
Global
Time and PlaceDate:
Wednesday, January 28, 2009
Time:
8:00pm - 10:00pm
Location:
Players Theatre
Street:
115 MacDougal St.
Contact InfoPhone:
2124751449
http://web.mac.com/msgouros/Site/Phil_Fried_%26_Lily.html
Event InfoHost:
Roulette
Type:
Music/Arts - Concert
Network:
Global
Time and PlaceDate:
Friday, January 30, 2009
Time:
8:30pm - 9:30pm
Location:
roulette intermedia
Street:
20 Greene Street (between Canal and Grand Streets).
City/Town:
East New York, NY
View Map
Google
MapQuest
Microsoft
Yahoo
Contact InfoPhone:
2122198242
Email:
roulette@roulette.org
http://www.roulette.org/
____________________________________
Phil's term for newly composed short term disposable opera:
FLOPPERA
__________________________________________________________
http://newmusicbox.org/chatter/chatter.nmbx?id=5835
A little levity:
On the other hand...
By philmusic
"..What if my treble dial has fallen off for good?.."
As some of us know Colin, Its all about the bass!
Phil Fried Phil Fried
Wednesday, January 14, 2009, 10:58:29 AM
_________________________________________
http://newmusicbox.org/chatter/chatter.nmbx?id=5838
a thought or 2
By philmusic
Frank, you cover a lot of ground on this one so I will give my answers in reverse.
As a listener I believe in no sonic prejudice, that does not mean that I like everything I hear. Rather I try to experience each work on its own and as openly as I can. Easy for me as I have no team to support. (For me its not serial composers right or wrong.)
Attitude
Most composers I know have a positive attitude in spite of the many rejections prevalent in our business.
It must be remembered that Pollyanna was not a "ninni" but a survivor. Yes a positive attitude is a good thing, then again, so is talent.
Phil Fried
Tuesday, January 20, 2009, 7:09:29 PM
__________________________________________
http://newmusicbox.org/chatter/chatter.nmbx?id=5839
Phil's patented operatic resume stuffer
By philmusic
Colin: I composed an opera titled:
Leading Opera houses in the United States and Europe.
This work has two singing parts:
Major Roles and Prima Donna
So If you perform my work you can add to your resume:
Performed Major Roles in Leading Opera houses in the United States and Europe.
Or the Prima Donna in Leading Opera houses in the United States and Europe.
Phil Fried
Comments: 0 Edit
reply to Edward Ortiz
By: Philip Fried Date: Jan 8, 2009 - 11:41 AM
http://newmusicbox.org/article.nmbx?id=5825
Something about this article rubbed me the wrong way. Not the ideas because clearly grand opera and chamber opera are different genres that need different approaches.
The subject of New Music Theatre, though not mentioned, is fair to avoid in this context.
Its not the facts eaither. It is reasonable to assume that recent music might be more expensive than warhorses. Though with all the variables of an opera production the figure of 4 times the cost for a new work (verses a new production of an old one for example )seems a little, well, suspect. One is reminded of the Vinyl shortage of the 1970 as a reason for the lack of new album releases.
What bugs me is this; the implicit acceptance of the operatic institutions and gate keepers as the nexus of the operatic art. Composers at best come in as a poor third place and thats only when they create works that are an "easy sell."
Well include me out.
Phil Fried
__________________________________________
http://newmusicbox.org/chatter/chatter.nmbx?id=5838
a thought or 2
By philmusic
Frank, you cover a lot of ground on this one so I will give my answers in reverse.
As a listener I believe in no sonic prejudice, that does not mean that I like everything I hear. Rather I try to experience each work on its own and as openly as I can. Easy for me as I have no team to support. (For me its not serial composers right or wrong.)
Attitude
Most composers I know have a positive attitude in spite of the many rejections prevalent in our business.
It must be remembered that Pollyanna was not a "ninni" but a survivor. Yes a positive attitude is a good thing, then again, so is talent.
Phil Fried
Tuesday, January 20, 2009, 7:09:29 PM
__________________________________________
http://newmusicbox.org/chatter/chatter.nmbx?id=5839
Phil's patented operatic resume stuffer
By philmusic
Colin: I composed an opera titled:
Leading Opera houses in the United States and Europe.
This work has two singing parts:
Major Roles and Prima Donna
So If you perform my work you can add to your resume:
Performed Major Roles in Leading Opera houses in the United States and Europe.
Or the Prima Donna in Leading Opera houses in the United States and Europe.
Phil Fried
Comments: 0 Edit
Doctor Atomic on TV
By: Philip Fried Date: Dec 29, 2008 - 10:09 PM
I suppose that I was disappointed in this work, yet not in the way that I expected--simply put I was bored. In this work the music, character, and voice were subsidiary to the visual concept.
First --thank god for the pan and scan cameras and those close ups or this work is dead in the water. Also without the supertitles most text would not be understood.
Problems:
1. Unmotivated activity:
The elements of theater do not align-
Music does not reflect the text, the text avoids the story
--unmotivated stage business and staging, unmotivated text, unmotivated music.
Scene 2 almost works but why do the two Oppenheimer's suddenly start fighting?
there are no text or musical clues for this or any other dramatic occurrence.
The music gets intense-yet the text is placid -the text gets intense-the music ignores it.
1. Orchestrally no obbligatos only accompaniments
2. All the accompaniments are ostinotos
3. constant syllabic text settings except for 2 notes at the end of every phrase, the women provide some relief, but not much as the melizmas are not on text but open vowel
4. the vocal lines have the effect of a typewriter
5. many vocal parts don't seem composed just improvised over the changes and in a hurry.
6. -text high points are not also musical ones
7. odd text choices for musical high points at that.
8. colorless meandering vocal lines, very similar, that all the characters use
9. no duets, no real ensembles.
10. Though I appreciate the use of the concept I call "context" in -batter my heart -this almost works, like Les Miz works, because of the text and music repetitions -yet again this goes on way too long. Also the success could be due to the excellent performance (a la Les Miz) in spite of the composition. Also Batter my heart is a real poem. This helps.
11. The chorus was impossible to understand
12. Inexperienced text writers, who look to Rock Opera, rather then grand opera, for its models.
13. instrumental composer composing theatrical vocal music again
14. the vocal music is never reflected or imitated in the orchestra
1. every story detail is expressed the same emotional level
1. the seams of the work's construction are very visible
The instrumental segues are interesting but seem made up of modernistic "effects" and though they sonically provide contrast and underscoring they frame scenes that they are also divorced from. Even here they the music is subservient to the set changes.
All this guilt about an event that according to many folks saved 500,000 American lives. This work also avoids many interesting side issues such as racism, or the Japanese experience within the work. The tack on at the end, with no emotion (irony), suggests that this is opera for the art crowd not for musicians.
The most important theatrical moment, the end, is not musical.
Other important theatrical musical moments are instrumental and not sung.
When there is music it does not explain the characters and the characters do not interact except as a staging device.
I think we have to look at what it takes to get a new opera done at the Met, or anywhere else for that matter. I wish I could say that the standard is high. This seems like an opera it just has no core. Perhaps the use of the term avant garde is just an excuse to sweep the dramatic failings under the rug-or perphaps this work is the true representation of its generations feelings. No feelings at all.
I'm afraid that only those who have a knack for getting high profile performances are the ones who can get an opera performed these days. Believing that skill as a vocal composers would be a factor in this is naive. Sigh. The Met was willing to use a director that had no opera experience. So why not a composer? Repeating the same mistakes each time does not equal experience.
One doesn't have to wonder at the critics positive reviews to this work-- its their schadenfreude at the impotence of the Modernist composers to get anything like this on board themselves.--still Berg and Schoenberg are in the opera repertory.This is spite of Mr. Adams positioned himself as the antidote to modernism. Actually there is much in common with this work and Mr. Carter's recent opera. Still, in Carter the music comes first.
The styles have changed and new gods are worshiped.
Oddly this work takes the musical delicatessen approach.
One is perhaps a little shocked that since the "met" has traditionally performed 3rd rate new music in its time, that this and other recent works are not included in this category. Why? Snob appeal perhaps? Fear of missing the boat? Professionalism is a given at the Met in all production areas but composition is something else again. Composers are not in house.
Why do so many folks who claim to be "outsiders" need to look up to an obvious insider as a "leader?" Outsiders can't get performed at the Met. It was bad enough when Boulez pretended to be the inside outsider. I still like his music. I can't say the same thing for Mr. Adams.
Music- D+
Character -F
Voice (vocal writing -- not the singing) - F
Extra Credit: direction, performances, costumes, sets, A+
Comments: 0 Edit
nmb round up
By: Philip Fried Date: Dec 26, 2008 - 02:28 PM
http://newmusicbox.org/chatter/chatter.nmbx?id=5810
lock stock and fach
By philmusic
Opera has become over the few last decades a directors art, re-dressing the old rather than creating the new, Even then the look is everything. One expects times to change and the opera with it yet many folks point out that many of the great singers of the recent past could not work today.
Visual trumps sound.
In America, in any case, the public is out of the loop as such decisions are made by the gate keepers. The overall health of music theater in America was strong, but who knows now? Yet the recent hard times might create opportunities for companies to go back to the basics and commissioning new operas to fit.
As long as there is music, character, and voice, opera survives.
Phil Fried
the means is the message?
By philmusic
".. people today are still uncomfortable with confronting the complex moral issues of the story. and it is, of course, incredibly sexually explicit and violent. it boils down to the fact that more modern pieces deal with more modern issues, and these are often issues that people don't want to deal with either in art or real life.."
Hmm.. Can you then explain Tbriggs why "spring awakening" by the same author with a story just as explicit is such a successful Broadway musical? Is it merely because the musical language and the English translation make it so accessible?
I think so. Its not about the text issues at all--its about the music. Which I love.
Phil Fried
_________________________________________________________________________
http://newmusicbox.org/chatter/chatter.nmbx?id=5814
my fav
By philmusic
Christmas and my soul, Laura Nyro
Phil Fried
__________________________________________________________________
http://www.sequenza21.com/index.php/1004#comment-14980
sequenza21 stuff
4 responses so far ↓
*
1 Phil Fried // Dec 24, 2008 at 11:02 pm
The next Music On MacDougal show will be Likeness to Lilly and Phil Fried on January 28th.
Just a heads up Happy Holidays!
see you there.
*
2 Phil Fried // Dec 24, 2008 at 11:09 pm
Oh–what am I? Chopped liver?
*
3 Steve Layton // Dec 25, 2008 at 12:26 am
We prefer to think of you as fine pâté, Phil.
*
4 Phil Fried // Dec 26, 2008 at 4:22 pm
Also your link is no good try this one:
http://web.mac.com/msgouros/Site/Phil_Fried_%26_Lily.html
Comments: 0 Edit
NMB rundown
By: Philip Fried Date: Dec 20, 2008 - 03:23 PM
http://newmusicbox.org/chatter/chatter.nmbx?id=5807
I'm not sure I need to reply to this post but unless a woman takes this up I will post this latter...
I agree with you Corey, yet I must mention that many artists, not just feminists, have such a unique experience with our messy world that they refuse to be subsumed into a universality that they feel is not theirs; the AACM for example. Why should they?
The actuarial tables and the male and female categories that the advertisers create and maintain to sell us stuff, including music, can not tell us who we are.
Accepting difference also means accepting rejection.
Phil Fried
______________________________________________________________________
Some fun!!!
my apologies in advance
By philmusic
a flesh eating zombie's x-mass
Moonlight and x-mass
fulfills my desire
you ring the bells
while I feast on the choir
We hang up the stockings with the feet still within
thats when our flesh eating zombie's merry x-mass begins
Us flesh eating zombie's we have no remorse
we're flesh eating zombie's you knew that of course
If we can't find humans then well eat your horse.
Or even a spouse from a messy divorce
We head to the shopping mall just after dark
and gnaw on the pedestrians just for a lark
we hope that the sharp shooters will miss their mark
Then we chortle with glee as our meals try to escape by climbing the big x-mass tree!
Moonlight and x-mass
fulfills my desire
you ring the bells
while I feast on the choir
We hang up the stockings with the feet still within
thats when our flesh eating zombie's merry x-mass begins
Phil Fried, Copyright 2008 all rights reserved
Friday, December 19, 2008, 10:38:18 AM
Comments: 0 Edit
NMB reply
By: Philip Fried Date: Dec 15, 2008 - 11:05 PM
http://newmusicbox.org/chatter/chatter.nmbx?id=5800
a thought
By philmusic
Colin, I understand your need to get back to work-I too have some things to attend to.
I'm not sure that I understand the nature of your alleged failure. Was it a performance problem, a composition problem, or a problem of personal expectations. Or was it your teachers expectations?
Yes composers should always bring their "A" game as preparation is a given, yet what was the context? Were they student performers-professionals?
Rehearsal technique requires experience especially if, for the performers, it's an early encounter with new stuff.
Colin, it just seems as if your comments on failure were not your own-rather they are the projection of the needs of others.
Phil Fried
Wednesday, December 10, 2008, 1:34:10 PM
Comments: 0 Edit
A Reply to Mr. Ness: NMB
By: Philip Fried Date: Dec 10, 2008 - 08:18 PM
http://newmusicbox.org/article.nmbx?id=5801
A Reply to Mr. Ness:
"...composers may berate one another for poor taste or lack of judgment and curse each other's successes.."
My my. Yet nothing has the vehemence or the anger of the back biting of theorists about the subjects of their work - the composer.
True there is some bad blood between the compositional teams, but I'm not convinced that this has any connection to the tonality debate at all. Rather tonality is simply a handy cudgel to avoid the more, lets say, inelegant causes of competition. Besides there is a new trend every year and new names invented for old concepts. Jargon that is new in name only.
Composers are hardly the only ones jockeying for success in this American milieu. I suppose that I resent Mr. Ness's implication that if I like the composers he likes I must fall in lock step to damn all the others too.
Of course one must take with a grain of salt those young academics who seem not be academics.
".. once the institutions of the music school and review become marginal forces in our lives.."
Mr. Ness says that he is going to discuss things tonal yet he spends more time talking about unnamed composers he doesn't like and named composers he does. Fairly typical actually.
Perhaps this is a good place to mention my thoughts on tautology make sense here:
Frank, being human, like and dislike precede all.
Folks just create a tautology to explain themselves. If smart these explanations can be interesting, providing insight, or it can just be a mystification or a simple knee jerk reaction.
Listening to others is the hardest skill to learn.
So is knowing when not to listen because those who know how to game the system (to gain an advantage) also know that anger will trump common sense.
Phil Fried
Of course if one defines ones research very narrow and accepts every thing at face value one could come up with similar conclusions to Mr. Ness.
So lets clarify with some thoughts, my own, about tonality.
1) Sound, and its organization, has been around a very long time
2) What we think of as common practice tonality has not been around very long
3) Sound and its organization are in constant flux
4)Music does not progress, styles and materials change.
Is Beethoven better than Mozart?
5) Theory cannot prove that work "a" is better than work "b"--only provide insight as to why that may be. It can attempt to persuade. Text does have an advantage as more folks read words than music.
6)The insights of theory have always come after the fact, based on the work of composers.
Mr. Ness's comment:
"...It is no coincidence that when German composer Helmut Lachenmann describes composing as "building an instrument,..."
Though interesting this does not mean that questions about "tonality" or pitch in his music or others are superfluous. Avoiding or renaming a problem does not solve it. The question is this; why if I love a composers music must I accept their personal, or their followers, explanations for it? For me the music comes first and I prefer to think for myself.
"..we could stop writing about music altogether, but music cannot—and will never—speak for itself.."
.
I disagree. Music is its own best advocate. Speaking of conflict, many composers have tussled not because of their music but because of their advocates forming "schools" to the exclusion of others.
No sonic prejudice!!
Phil Fried
Comments: 0 Edit
Me on new sounds WNYC
By: Philip Fried Date: Dec 2, 2008 - 08:58 PM
http://www.wnyc.org/flashplayer/player.html#/play//stream/xspf/112530
Hey folks me on new sounds with some other excellent folks I'm on after 30 min--but some interesting banter about the music before.
thanks
Comments: 0 Edit
no nmb this week
By: Philip Fried Date: Nov 21, 2008 - 02:19 PM
Strange isn't It?
Well I'm gearing up for my NYC performances in Jan 28 and 30. Roulette and Music on Macdougel
Details details--I have to get a custom ata case for my bass-find a hotel. Etc.
Anyway, There is more to say!
Comments: 0 Edit
this week NMB round up
By: Philip Fried Date: Nov 14, 2008 - 07:43 PM
http://newmusicbox.org/chatter/chatter.nmbx?id=5772
a long post for me but I do love the twin cities since moving here I get gigs in NY! go figure.
Inside man?
By philmusic
"Please note that I'm not trying to belittle the oasis of musical culture coincident with the 612 area code at all..."
I'm kind of torn on this one Colin as generalizations can have, well, exceptions.
First I think I can say that an organization man I'm not.
That said composition has been an uphill struggle for me as it is for many of us. My point is this I lived in NYC, the great artistic center, for many years and I couldn't get arrested. This was due to the style police out in force and my own inability to get the power folks to support my work.
It is also true that I went to many many many different types of concerts there. There are also here if you try the various dance/theatatrical/non-com rock performances.
Since moving to the twin cities me and my wife Janet have developed a career and not a bad one either. I was taken seriously from the moment I presented my work to the Red Eye theater. That was a change.
I find it interesting that there is such a strong reginal sound attached to here. Folks love it. A sound that as it happens is very differen't from my own.
The problem with your comments is that they can be misinterpreted as parochial university speak. That is;
Those who earn a living from their art, and/or outside the Academy, must be purveying a lessor sort of product than those inside.
I don't believe that yet I too miss Europe and the Arditti Quartet.
Phil Fried
_________________________________________________________
http://newmusicbox.org/chatter/chatter.nmbx?id=5771
A good time here!!!
Well now that you mention it..
By philmusic
"..kinda like being a Joe Liebermann of music perhaps.."
Well, I always wanted to be the "Joe da plumber" of music.
Phil Fried
Tuesday, November 11, 2008, 5:27:16 PM
By colin holter
I consider myself the Alan Keyes of new music.
Tuesday, November 11, 2008, 5:53:36 PM
expertise at work
By philmusic
Pardon me Colin, but I really think you might be the Allen wrench of new music.
Phil Fried
Comments: 0 Edit
concert tonight MN Orchestra and some NMB
By: Philip Fried Date: Nov 7, 2008 - 09:34 AM
http://newmusicbox.org/chatter/chatter.nmbx?id=5760
One of my main concepts
a thought
By philmusic
Frank, being human, like and dislike precede all.
Folks just create a tautology to explain themselves. If smart these explanations can be interesting, providing insight, or it can just be a mystification or a simple knee jerk reaction.
Listening to others is the hardest skill to learn.
So is knowing when not to listen because those who know how to game the system (to gain an advantage) also know that anger will trump common sense.
Phil Fried
http://newmusicbox.org/chatter/chatter.nmbx?id=5753
political music? The problem is people react to the message (title) not the music. Hence William's support for a work he has not heard
a question...
By philmusic
What I would ask is;
Is this a question of an evocative/commemorative title for an instrumental work, or is this a tone poem with a scenario embedded into the music?
Since I have composed political music myself I have found that songs, theatrical works, and tone poems tend to have less ambiguity of understanding.
Then again, after all, the music comes first.
Phil Fried
Monday, November 03, 2008, 2:30:43 PM
__________________________________________________________________
http://newmusicbox.org/chatter/chatter.nmbx?id=5762
It seems a no brainer that composing for 90 people might require a different approach then working with a few new musics specialists. No one points out that many new music performers can't play mainstream-and the best new music performances come from non specialist performers.
I agree that notation is not written in stone and has many new paths to explore--but to me that's a separate issue.
music convention VS conventional music
By philmusic
At this time I am aware of several different ways of notating- lets call them advanced techniques- for instruments. Some are idiosyncratic so that the composers who use them prefer to stick with the same performers who know their style over and over again. Quite a few of these actually. Also many college new music ensembles offer a a composer not only a lot of practice time but also a lot of supervision.
How would this translate into a big band situation like the MN Orchestra?
Given enough time and rehearsal the Minnesota Orchestra, or any major professional orchestra for that matter can pretty much can learn anything. Time--that is the fact. Every moment spent haggling over notation method means less rehearsal/practice time.
Observing the conventions of writing for orchestra is not the same as composing conventional music.
Phil Fried
Comments: 0 Edit
this weeks NMB
By: Philip Fried Date: Oct 31, 2008 - 04:37 AM
http://newmusicbox.org/chatter/chatter.nmbx?id=5748
a personal perspective
By philmusic
"..dodecaphonic composers haven't all completely abandoned their methods just because the neo-romantics came along..."
Very true Frank as you know in my case. I think its time we all listened for the quality of the music not merely for its style.
no sonic prejudice
Phil Fried
http://newmusicbox.org/chatter/chatter.nmbx?id=5738
Ryan doesn't get my subtle arguments and is up to his old tricks a agin-a new voice joins us yet Daniel. His comments alludes to how he avoids Zappa's problem of intention- that a composer can't control how their works are perceived (a well known fact)-- by not having any intention. A good example of "spin."
Iron knee
By philmusic
Colin-I don't know the quote you refer to. Was it about Bert Bacharach? As for "Irony" it seems the basis for a whole lot of recent music, especial of the post-modern type. As for me the problem with Irony is that it can be too text or editorial based, and further, sometimes is the "real thing."
That is- Irony can be a code word for "spin."
Phil Fried
my my my
By philmusic
Ryan, it is quite posiible to present a so called "ironic" event that has no incongruity at all.
I stand by my statement.
By the way, my Mother who is 85, loves the Daily Show. As do all her friends.
Phil Fried
one example and there are many more..
By philmusic
Ok Frank Zappa wrote a song called "Valley Girl". Like many of Zappa's texts it was a severe put down, in this case, of Valley Girls and their mangling of the English language.
Oddly, it sold like hot cakes. Not only did it end up promoting a trend I think it was Zappa's biggest selling song as well.
The public just didn't get it--they thought the song was a "celebration" of "Valley speak".
So an ironic and satirical put down song becomes a celebration of the thing it seeks to criticize.
Hardly what Zappa intended--or did he?
meaning?
By philmusic
"..After deciding to accept the audience's meaning as valid I then stopped trying to achieve meaning via composition..."
Well then Daniel you would agree with Randy who has noted on more than one occasion that music has no meaning.
It seems inconsistent that music for the listener might have a meaning but for the composer no dice. Most composers no matter what their point of view do expect their listeners to get something out of the listening experience after all.
Yet if music has no meaning and I'm thinking about absolute music here, as visual images and written editorials do tend to lead one in a direction, the concepts of integrity, irony, and struggle are irrelevant
Phil Fried
Baggage handler
I understand your point Daniel but I also see some contradictions.
Though it is true that all arts have baggage some of it we are not aware of. That is some of us carry certain baggage and some of it appears in advertisements in magazines we have never read. More people read text than read music, so the baggage of text is far more familiar and powerful to most folks than music is. Also studies have shown most humans are visual learners. Advantage visual.
Seeking to be on an equal plane as your audience is interesting. For myself as a composer I merely seek a disinterested audience and I certainly don't believe in the existence of a "monolithic" audience. There are just too many different auditors out there. How can an group of of college professors be compared to a group of 3rd graders?
Does an "Egoless" artist actively present their work? How does one describe an artist that claims to have found a solution for a problem that threw Frank Zappa for a loop? You chose not to discuss his work-but your own -of which I am unfamiliar. Doesn't this kind of argument just devolve into spin?
Anyway "Egolessness" goes against the grain of today's professional outlook.
Well kudos for that.
Phil Fried
Comments: 0 Edit
this week NMB
By: Philip Fried Date: Oct 24, 2008 - 06:10 PM
http://newmusicbox.org/chatter/chatter.nmbx?id=5733
It so happens Adrianne that there is no review--just a "puff" piece.
Its rather smug to accuse others of being jealous ----well...
the point
By philmusic
Um, I don't think we realize what this concert and hundreds of others like it mean. The gatekeepers are outsourcing music composition away from professional composers. I'm not just talking about the "anything but serial types" though that's certainly in the mix.
If there is any sign of our loss of status in the professional world this is it.
Phil Fried
On second thought ..
By philmusic
Perhaps it also shows that for some reason everybody still wants to be us.
Phil Fried, on a much more positive note
_____________________________________________________
http://newmusicbox.org/chatter/chatter.nmbx?id=5735
Well I talk about this topic in my lessons--Steve gets utopian on us
Ryan gets on his high horse again
Composer vs. Sound Artist
By philmusic
Its interesting Linda that you title your post about the differences between electroacoustic composers and sound artists this way.
Are they at odds?
They must be in some ways as they both compete for many of the same grants, fellowships, and jobs.
Phil Fried
What did I say....
By philmusic
"Well if you ain't gonna bother debunking it in specific terms, then my point will still stand..."
No Ryan. Actually you have merely made an assertion.
Ryan do you honestly intend to hold others to a high standard of "evidence" when you don't do so for yourself?
Phil Fried, I feel better already
_______________________________________________________
http://newmusicbox.org/chatter/chatter.nmbx?id=5737
I have a different take on this subject-about inhabiting different guise--I start out funny!
confusion?
By philmusic
".. it's an undeniable classic of its genre with virtually no detractors.."
Yes, but are there any virtually virtual detractors?
I mean Dune has virtually no detractors who are virtual??
Sorry
Phil Fried who notes that Dune is partly based on T.E. Lawrence's 7 pillars of Wisdom.
By philmusic
"..Actually perhaps a better example might be Gershwin's Rhapsody in Blue or Porgy and Bess, which are both totally unlike what had preceded them..."
Frank, a few years back I attended a concert conducted by Gunther Schuller, where he performed just such a work--the name of the composer, who was African American, escapes me now.
Anyone with info?
Just because Gershwin is remembered doesn't necessarily make his work the "first".
Phil Fried
By philmusic
Thats him! A fine work as I remember.
This get me thinking about T.E. Laurence (of Arabia) again. He mentions in his book that living as another culture is a "yahoo life". Yet we as composers frequently set songs and libretti with the intention of dramatizing things other than ourselves.
Different; genders, ages, cultures, nationalities, sexual orientations, politics, colors, intelligence, animals, inanimate objects, even spirits, etc., etc.
Perhaps then it is better to understand the "many" rather than being the "one".
Phil Fried
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no nmb this week
By: Philip Fried Date: Nov 21, 2008 - 02:19 PM
Strange isn't It?
Well I'm gearing up for my NYC performances in Jan 28 and 30. Roulette and Music on Macdougel
Details details--I have to get a custom ata case for my bass-find a hotel. Etc.
Anyway, There is more to say!
Comments: -1 Edit
this week NMB round up
By: Philip Fried Date: Nov 14, 2008 - 07:43 PM
http://newmusicbox.org/chatter/chatter.nmbx?id=5772
a long post for me but I do love the twin cities since moving here I get gigs in NY! go figure.
Inside man?
By philmusic
"Please note that I'm not trying to belittle the oasis of musical culture coincident with the 612 area code at all..."
I'm kind of torn on this one Colin as generalizations can have, well, exceptions.
First I think I can say that an organization man I'm not.
That said composition has been an uphill struggle for me as it is for many of us. My point is this I lived in NYC, the great artistic center, for many years and I couldn't get arrested. This was due to the style police out in force and my own inability to get the power folks to support my work.
It is also true that I went to many many many different types of concerts there. There are also here if you try the various dance/theatatrical/non-com rock performances.
Since moving to the twin cities me and my wife Janet have developed a career and not a bad one either. I was taken seriously from the moment I presented my work to the Red Eye theater. That was a change.
I find it interesting that there is such a strong reginal sound attached to here. Folks love it. A sound that as it happens is very differen't from my own.
The problem with your comments is that they can be misinterpreted as parochial university speak. That is;
Those who earn a living from their art, and/or outside the Academy, must be purveying a lessor sort of product than those inside.
I don't believe that yet I too miss Europe and the Arditti Quartet.
Phil Fried
_________________________________________________________
http://newmusicbox.org/chatter/chatter.nmbx?id=5771
A good time here!!!
Well now that you mention it..
By philmusic
"..kinda like being a Joe Liebermann of music perhaps.."
Well, I always wanted to be the "Joe da plumber" of music.
Phil Fried
Tuesday, November 11, 2008, 5:27:16 PM
By colin holter
I consider myself the Alan Keyes of new music.
Tuesday, November 11, 2008, 5:53:36 PM
expertise at work
By philmusic
Pardon me Colin, but I really think you might be the Allen wrench of new music.
Phil Fried
Comments: 0 Edit
concert tonight MN Orchestra and some NMB
By: Philip Fried Date: Nov 7, 2008 - 09:34 AM
http://newmusicbox.org/chatter/chatter.nmbx?id=5760
One of my main concepts
a thought
By philmusic
Frank, being human, like and dislike precede all.
Folks just create a tautology to explain themselves. If smart these explanations can be interesting, providing insight, or it can just be a mystification or a simple knee jerk reaction.
Listening to others is the hardest skill to learn.
So is knowing when not to listen because those who know how to game the system (to gain an advantage) also know that anger will trump common sense.
Phil Fried
http://newmusicbox.org/chatter/chatter.nmbx?id=5753
political music? The problem is people react to the message (title) not the music. Hence William's support for a work he has not heard
a question...
By philmusic
What I would ask is;
Is this a question of an evocative/commemorative title for an instrumental work, or is this a tone poem with a scenario embedded into the music?
Since I have composed political music myself I have found that songs, theatrical works, and tone poems tend to have less ambiguity of understanding.
Then again, after all, the music comes first.
Phil Fried
Monday, November 03, 2008, 2:30:43 PM
__________________________________________________________________
http://newmusicbox.org/chatter/chatter.nmbx?id=5762
It seems a no brainer that composing for 90 people might require a different approach then working with a few new musics specialists. No one points out that many new music performers can't play mainstream-and the best new music performances come from non specialist performers.
I agree that notation is not written in stone and has many new paths to explore--but to me that's a separate issue.
music convention VS conventional music
By philmusic
At this time I am aware of several different ways of notating- lets call them advanced techniques- for instruments. Some are idiosyncratic so that the composers who use them prefer to stick with the same performers who know their style over and over again. Quite a few of these actually. Also many college new music ensembles offer a a composer not only a lot of practice time but also a lot of supervision.
How would this translate into a big band situation like the MN Orchestra?
Given enough time and rehearsal the Minnesota Orchestra, or any major professional orchestra for that matter can pretty much can learn anything. Time--that is the fact. Every moment spent haggling over notation method means less rehearsal/practice time.
Observing the conventions of writing for orchestra is not the same as composing conventional music.
Phil Fried
Comments: 0 Edit
this weeks NMB
By: Philip Fried Date: Oct 31, 2008 - 04:37 AM
http://newmusicbox.org/chatter/chatter.nmbx?id=5748
a personal perspective
By philmusic
"..dodecaphonic composers haven't all completely abandoned their methods just because the neo-romantics came along..."
Very true Frank as you know in my case. I think its time we all listened for the quality of the music not merely for its style.
no sonic prejudice
Phil Fried
http://newmusicbox.org/chatter/chatter.nmbx?id=5738
Ryan doesn't get my subtle arguments and is up to his old tricks a agin-a new voice joins us yet Daniel. His comments alludes to how he avoids Zappa's problem of intention- that a composer can't control how their works are perceived (a well known fact)-- by not having any intention. A good example of "spin."
Iron knee
By philmusic
Colin-I don't know the quote you refer to. Was it about Bert Bacharach? As for "Irony" it seems the basis for a whole lot of recent music, especial of the post-modern type. As for me the problem with Irony is that it can be too text or editorial based, and further, sometimes is the "real thing."
That is- Irony can be a code word for "spin."
Phil Fried
my my my
By philmusic
Ryan, it is quite posiible to present a so called "ironic" event that has no incongruity at all.
I stand by my statement.
By the way, my Mother who is 85, loves the Daily Show. As do all her friends.
Phil Fried
one example and there are many more..
By philmusic
Ok Frank Zappa wrote a song called "Valley Girl". Like many of Zappa's texts it was a severe put down, in this case, of Valley Girls and their mangling of the English language.
Oddly, it sold like hot cakes. Not only did it end up promoting a trend I think it was Zappa's biggest selling song as well.
The public just didn't get it--they thought the song was a "celebration" of "Valley speak".
So an ironic and satirical put down song becomes a celebration of the thing it seeks to criticize.
Hardly what Zappa intended--or did he?
meaning?
By philmusic
"..After deciding to accept the audience's meaning as valid I then stopped trying to achieve meaning via composition..."
Well then Daniel you would agree with Randy who has noted on more than one occasion that music has no meaning.
It seems inconsistent that music for the listener might have a meaning but for the composer no dice. Most composers no matter what their point of view do expect their listeners to get something out of the listening experience after all.
Yet if music has no meaning and I'm thinking about absolute music here, as visual images and written editorials do tend to lead one in a direction, the concepts of integrity, irony, and struggle are irrelevant
Phil Fried
Baggage handler
I understand your point Daniel but I also see some contradictions.
Though it is true that all arts have baggage some of it we are not aware of. That is some of us carry certain baggage and some of it appears in advertisements in magazines we have never read. More people read text than read music, so the baggage of text is far more familiar and powerful to most folks than music is. Also studies have shown most humans are visual learners. Advantage visual.
Seeking to be on an equal plane as your audience is interesting. For myself as a composer I merely seek a disinterested audience and I certainly don't believe in the existence of a "monolithic" audience. There are just too many different auditors out there. How can an group of of college professors be compared to a group of 3rd graders?
Does an "Egoless" artist actively present their work? How does one describe an artist that claims to have found a solution for a problem that threw Frank Zappa for a loop? You chose not to discuss his work-but your own -of which I am unfamiliar. Doesn't this kind of argument just devolve into spin?
Anyway "Egolessness" goes against the grain of today's professional outlook.
Well kudos for that.
Phil Fried
Comments: 0 Edit
this week NMB
By: Philip Fried Date: Oct 24, 2008 - 06:10 PM
http://newmusicbox.org/chatter/chatter.nmbx?id=5733
It so happens Adrianne that there is no review--just a "puff" piece.
Its rather smug to accuse others of being jealous ----well...
the point
By philmusic
Um, I don't think we realize what this concert and hundreds of others like it mean. The gatekeepers are outsourcing music composition away from professional composers. I'm not just talking about the "anything but serial types" though that's certainly in the mix.
If there is any sign of our loss of status in the professional world this is it.
Phil Fried
On second thought ..
By philmusic
Perhaps it also shows that for some reason everybody still wants to be us.
Phil Fried, on a much more positive note
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http://newmusicbox.org/chatter/chatter.nmbx?id=5735
Well I talk about this topic in my lessons--Steve gets utopian on us
Ryan gets on his high horse again
Composer vs. Sound Artist
By philmusic
Its interesting Linda that you title your post about the differences between electroacoustic composers and sound artists this way.
Are they at odds?
They must be in some ways as they both compete for many of the same grants, fellowships, and jobs.
Phil Fried
What did I say....
By philmusic
"Well if you ain't gonna bother debunking it in specific terms, then my point will still stand..."
No Ryan. Actually you have merely made an assertion.
Ryan do you honestly intend to hold others to a high standard of "evidence" when you don't do so for yourself?
Phil Fried, I feel better already
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http://newmusicbox.org/chatter/chatter.nmbx?id=5737
I have a different take on this subject-about inhabiting different guise--I start out funny!
confusion?
By philmusic
".. it's an undeniable classic of its genre with virtually no detractors.."
Yes, but are there any virtually virtual detractors?
I mean Dune has virtually no detractors who are virtual??
Sorry
Phil Fried who notes that Dune is partly based on T.E. Lawrence's 7 pillars of Wisdom.
By philmusic
"..Actually perhaps a better example might be Gershwin's Rhapsody in Blue or Porgy and Bess, which are both totally unlike what had preceded them..."
Frank, a few years back I attended a concert conducted by Gunther Schuller, where he performed just such a work--the name of the composer, who was African American, escapes me now.
Anyone with info?
Just because Gershwin is remembered doesn't necessarily make his work the "first".
Phil Fried
By philmusic
Thats him! A fine work as I remember.
This get me thinking about T.E. Laurence (of Arabia) again. He mentions in his book that living as another culture is a "yahoo life". Yet we as composers frequently set songs and libretti with the intention of dramatizing things other than ourselves.
Different; genders, ages, cultures, nationalities, sexual orientations, politics, colors, intelligence, animals, inanimate objects, even spirits, etc., etc.
Perhaps then it is better to understand the "many" rather than being the "one".
Phil Fried
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